The baptism of Lydia Ball

2. Parents of Lydia Ball:

NOTES on her marriage (being the earliest record I have for Lydia Ball).  Link to a scan of the original certificate (warning big file: 650KB).  The original is not at all easy to read, but I think it says that at Lydia Ball's marriage on 8th. October 1849 (to William Sweetman) both bride and groom give their ages as 30. If William Sweetman was born 27 Sep 1819, as indicated from the IGI he would have been exactly 30; perhaps Lydia was in fact older but said she was 30?  The marriage was a Baptist one at what I think is AEnon Chapel (which was in Church Street, Marylebone); there are no baptism records from there in the L.M.A., would it be worth trying to trace this Baptist Chapel - see the book "My Ancestors were Baptists".   Lydia signed her name, as did William and the witness Martha Ball (and Sarah ?Newman? made her mark). Lydia did not report any profession and her address was 17 Bridport Street.  William Sweetman gave his address as 18 Princess Street, and a year later Lydia Sweetman was born at 19 Princess Street - the same place as they were at the 1851 census.  I've tried to see if Martha Ball gives any clues - a sister perhaps - but there is no obvious Martha Ball in the 1851 census.

4. Where to next?

1] Baptist records?  I've tried all those at the FRC - and had one look at the PRO at Kew.   Could she have been baptised as an adult? See the booklet "My Ancestors were Baptists".  Can I trace this AEnon or Enon Chapel and it's records? (it was in the area redeveloped as the Church Street Estate) - is the 1851 Ecclesiastical census at the PRO any help?  The Westminster Archive has only one more recent note of Aenon Chapel. Check where Christ Church, Church Street [W72] is in RG4/4522?

2] 1841?  I have searched the 1841 census (because that should give her mother's forename, but that won't be much further help except to give the address where Lydia and her parents were living). I've tried the global index for a Lydia Ball born around 1818 possibly born and living in the Westminster or Marylebone area.  I also checked Bridport Street house by house and they are not there but mis-indexed.  Further possibilities in the 1841 census that I've looked at include: William Sweetman (bn Sep 1819, Kent with/without parents Thomas and Sophia who married 1815 in Sussex and also checked surname as Sweetnam and Sweatman) and William Ball born say 1775 to 1800 (but that's really not enough to go on). 
    However note:  "Known problems with the 1841 Census: The following table shows piece numbers where part or all of the piece is missing, as well as piece numbers that were not used....
680    Middlesex    Parish: Paddington"

3] Further Parish Registers?  Continue searching the more distant and obscure parish registers from Westminster and Marylebone for the baptism of Lydia Ball (father William) in around 1815 to 1821 [see this page].  Start with parishes that were least far from the border between Westminster and Marylebone - as per Phillimore.  In particular try the City of Westminster Archives Centre for any remaining Westminster parish registers that are not in the IGI (see this page).

4]  Police records?  Are there any further details for William Ball from the Metropolitan Police archives?

5] FHSs?  Any local help in either West Middlesex FHS or  London & North Middlesex FHS (now with Westminster & Central Middlesex FHS)?

6] Death of William Ball?  Continue searching for the death of William Ball (see this page) from MQ 1854 forward, possibly Marylebone area; but without ages it would be difficult to spot the right one from the index (see this page) it could be expensive, and so what if I found it - it probably won't tell me much.  Is it worth checking the wills and admons for a William Ball?

7] Bibles to her grandsons? In her will Lydia Sweetman (nee Ball) mentions passing on two Bibles consisting of three volumes each to her grandsons Charles Walter Elliott and Thomas Joseph Elliott is there any way of tracing those bibles?

8] 1851 census for William Ball?   If her father William was a Serjiant in the Metropolitan Police force at the time of the 1851 census could he have been living at a Police Station? I have seacrhed  the 1851 census both for William Ball and for Police Stations around the Marylebone area. Before it was fully indexed on ancestry.com I also searched most of the films in the area around Marylebone and Westminster.  See this page.
 
 

No match in the IGI:
There is NO Lydia Ball whose father is William christened between 1810 and 1835 in the IGI, either on-line (22 Nov 2005) or on the latest full CD set and addendum at South Kensington (Jan 2003), or on the British Isles Vital records CD set.

The closest Lydia is:
Lydia Ball Ch. 04/05/1817 St. George the Martyr, Southwark. Father: Joseph, mother Eleanor

There is NO Martha Ball whose father is William, christened in London between 1810 and 1830 in the IGI.

The only London Marylebone or Westminster children born with a father William Ball are:
Hannah d.o. William & Ann Ball 20/08/1815 Tichfield Street Calvanist Independent, St. Marylebone.
Hannah d.o. William & Hannah Ball 10/06/1818 St. Marylebone.
Ellen d.o. William Pierce & Charlotte Ball 23/05/1820  St. Marylebone.
William s.o. William & Eleanor Ball 29/03/1812  St. Marylebone.
 
 

Possible marriages of William Ball from the IGI:

06 Jan 1811 to Mary Hinds,  St. Marylebone, St. Marylebone

02 Sep 1804 to Lydia Wivill,  St. Pancras, Old Church, London

06 Sep 1803 to Isabella Gilmour,  St. Marylebone, St. Marylebone

26 Dec 1802 to Sarah Burt,  St. Martin in the Fields, Westminster

 

No match in the Non-conformist records in FRC:

a] Dr. Williams' Library.
In the pre 1837 indexes for baptisms, in RG4/4670 (1812 to 1817), 4671 (1817 to 1820) and 4672 (1820 to 1824) there is no Lydia Ball.  The only Balls noted are children of Thomas & Sarah (Sarah, Joseph and Priscilla F3851 to F3853), children of Philip & Thomasin (in Cornwall - E1057 to E1062) and children of Isaac & Elizabeth (E2182)

b] Wesleyan-Methodist Metropolitan Register.  Births and baptisms 1818 to 1840 RG4/4680
The only Lydia Ball is 2019/253 (on RG5/172). Daughter of John and Susanna, baptized 29th. July 1821 at Barnstaple in Devon.
The other Ball children I found are:  Samuel 22/3; William Limmington 23/3; Thomas 24/3; Mary (Ball or Bell?) 297/263; Jane 442/46; Amelia 2323/291; Abel 2533/317; Louisa 2605/326; John 2609/327; Mary Sophia 3086/386; James 4732/593; John 7508/828; Elizabeth 8283/925; Jane 8562/959 and James 8927/1010.
 

From a kind GR lookup the closest match was:
BALL, Lydia Christening
Gender: Female
Birth Date: 10 Jul 1821
Christening Date: 29 Jul 1821 Recorded in: London, London, England
Collection: Paternoster Row; Wesleyan Methodist Registry
Father:  John BALL
Mother:  Susanna VAUTER
Mother's Father:  John VAUTER
Mother's Mother:  Marey
Source: FHL Film 828115 Dates: 1820 - 1821   Note: Additional Data in Original Record

Nothing at the S.o.G.
There is nothing useful I could see at SoG under Ball in upper library (boxes or books or card catalogue).

Nothing on the ground
I've looked around the area of Aenon Chapel Church Street, Bridport Street and Princess Street on foot and there is not a single part of it that is pre 1950s - all utterly re-developed, most of the roads do not follow the old ones.
 

Censuses still to find:

1841: Lydia Ball (or William) is NOT in the index or at at Bridport Street.
    However note:  "Known problems with the 1841 Census: The following table shows piece numbers where part or all of the piece is missing, as well as piece numbers that were not used....
680    Middlesex    Parish: Paddington"

1851: William Ball and family are NOT in the index or in  the Marylebone at all - I've checked every single Ball indexed in many films in the Marylebone and Westminster area,  and also looked at Bridport Street carefully in case they were mis-indexed.

 

Further pages for:

Parish Register search results for the birth of Lydia Ball

Death of William Ball, possible entries from the GRO index

William Ball, Serjiant of Police in the 1851 census, age say 50 to 70

Stephen E. Tarling family history  birth brief details still needed

Names needed to complete 6 generations

Stephen E. Tarling family history home page